Episode 28

Why Talented People Fail and Tenacious People Don't (The U2 Roadie Who Proved It)

July 15, 2026 · 42 min

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The Short Answer

Scott Scovill was diagnosed with a clinical fear of failure so severe a psychologist said grabbing a red-hot stove would be easier than trying. He flunked out of college, waited tables at a highway Howard Johnson's, then snuck into U2 shows for five weeks working for free. Three years later he was on tour with the Rolling Stones. When he interviewed household names for his book, including Brad Paisley, Alan Jackson, Peter Frampton, and Garth Brooks, not one of them credited talent. Every one of them credited refusing to quit.

What You'll Take Away

Fear operates through small deflections more than big walls, keeping you picking up sticks in the yard instead of chasing the dream.
One step forward instantly changes who you are, from the person too afraid to do it to the person doing it.
The most talented people you have never heard of gave up, while the household names kept going.
Tenacity is one hundred percent developable because you can decide to be tenacious and become it the moment you stick to it.
Failure is a stepping stone, not death, and you learn everything in failure and nothing from not trying.
When you realise something scares you, run straight towards it instead of letting fear have power over you.
You do not use tenacity to do the things that are easy for you, you use it to do the things you really want to do even though they are hard.

The Breakdown

A psychologist once told Scott Scovill it would be easier for him to grab a red-hot stove and hang on than to actually try at anything. That was the diagnosis. An extreme fear of failure. He flunked out of college. His teachers got together and said they were going to push him out. He ended up waiting tables at a highway Howard Johnson's, not his dream job, and he was not even a very good waiter.

Then a tour bus rolled in with a space shuttle painted on the side. Scott thought they worked for NASA. He was disappointed when they walked off the bus wearing black with long hair. He took their drink orders and asked why the bus. One of them, in the thickest Irish accent, said they worked for the band U2 and put on the show. That blew his mind.

He had a million questions. He did not understand how you could work for U2 without being Bono's cousin. The guy in charge laughed and said seven of them were the very best in the world at what they did, they put on the show, the lights, the sound, and then he put his arm around the guy next to him and said this is AJ, he is Bono's cousin. Everyone started laughing. They revealed a world that was incredible. Finally, after a million questions, they said they had to go. Why not come to the next show and they would answer more questions.

The Paradigm Shift in the Dark

Scott went to that show. He had a million more questions. He was so fascinated about the career he had discovered that he was more interested in it than the fact that he just met two of his heroes. Lights went out, crowd went nuts. He was standing in the middle of 15,000 screaming fans, and he had a paradigm shift. This is what you are going to do with your life. You love music, you love technology, you love travel, you are going to see the world with U2.

A moment later, his heart sank when he realised to do any of this, he was going to have to try. He made himself a promise standing there in the dark that he was going to start trying and never stop trying no matter how bad it got or how much it hurt. In that moment, tenacity was born within him. It was a struggle for the next few years, but that is where it started.

That moment was one of maybe two or three pivotal moments in his life. It led to the dumbest plan ever. He decided he was going to quit his three jobs, sell his Super Sport Camaro, and move into his Subaru BRAT, those tiny little pickup trucks. He started sneaking into U2 shows and working for free. His plan was he was going to make himself invaluable to them.

My psychologist said it would be easier for you to grab a red hot stove and hang on and maim yourself than to actually try.

Scott Scovill

Five Weeks Living in a Truck

Somehow they did not have him arrested. The police almost arrested him three times getting in the building, but the crew was like, what are you doing in here? And he said he was just figuring it out, just another one of the stagehands. For five weeks, he snuck in every day, worked for free. While they were all sleeping on the bus, he was driving all night to the next city. He just killed himself doing it. But it was a start. He was finally moving.

He had a fake laminate, but it was not totally fake. The backside of their laminates was white. He made a laminate that was white on both sides. He saw that they had radio channels and laminates hanging around their necks with radio channel numbers and things on them they needed to remember. He made that, but not the official pass. When you are trying to get in during the show, security is high. If you wait till after the show when the stagehands are showing up, way lighter. He was not going to the shows. He was not a groupie. He was a roadie groupie. He wanted to be in with the work.

It was lighter, and he would just look like he did not want to be there with his fake laminate hanging around his neck. If someone caught him and stopped him, which happened pretty often, he would act freaked out that he had lost his laminate and not seem like he was worried about getting in trouble with them. He would be like, oh my god, they are going to kill me, maybe it is on the bus. And he would turn around and run back up the ramp like he was going to the bus to find his laminate. Then he would sneak in a different door. Only three times did it get to where he was talking to the police and having to do some fast talking. But they did not arrest me.

He became something of a mascot. The truck drivers and all that were rooting for him. Every now and then, they would lay on the horn if he was swerving a little bit, and they would yell at him at the truck stops. You have got to pull over. You cannot make it all night. And he would be like, okay. And then he would just pull out way behind them so they could not see him anymore because if he lost them, he would have to find the place, and GPSs did not exist back then. This was 1987.

This is what you're going to do with your life. You love music, you love technology, you love travel, oh my gosh, you're going to see the world with you too. A moment later, my heart sank when I realized to do any of this, I was going to have to try.

Scott Scovill

The Union Dispute That Ended It

He did all that for five weeks. Felt like he was maybe making some impact, but the reality is they were all experts at what they did. He was just figuring out how to coil cables and latch road cases. He did not belong. But five weeks in, the union in Buffalo had a dispute with the band, and someone was saying something about him, and that ended up in the union's ears. In their argument over a bigger problem, they said, and you have nonunion labour here working with you, and that is stealing union jobs, and they fined the band five thousand dollars.

Scott does not think the band ever had to pay it, but that event drew attention to him. Upper management went, what are you guys doing? You are letting this kid roll around? He is going to fall asleep in the middle of the night, crash his car, and his parents are going to sue us, and his life is going to be on our hands. He has to go. So he made it five weeks before that moment.

Good timing, because video was brand new to the industry. He had a lot of time to think while he was driving from city to city. If he was going to get into this industry, he wanted to do the thing that was brand new. Instead of getting on the bottom rung of the lighting ladder, he did not want to be brand new at the thing that people have been doing for thirty years. Why not be brand new at the thing that has been around for a year? Video was literally brand new at shows at that point.

It is in fact, it's a stepping stone. It's necessary. It's where you learn everything. You learn everything in failure, you learn nothing from not failing and hanging it out there.

Scott Scovill

Rolling Stones and Imposter Syndrome

He got some great advice from the crew who were great friends to him. Lawrence Anderson from the crew said, go to school for this projector because nobody knows how to run it and you will get work. He did. He was hired before he even got out of the one week long class on how to do the projector. A company out of DC hired him. He did corporate video for a year and a half. The company was great. His coworkers were great. He hated the work. No loud screaming fans. No music. Just ballrooms and videos on why software is good, you should buy it and things like that.

But he learned the gear and kept trying to put himself in the right place at the right time and managed to be in the right place at the right time and draw interest from someone who had just gotten the Rolling Stones tour. Within three years of that U2 encounter, he was on tour with the Rolling Stones doing the biggest tour in the world.

Still hard because he felt like he was in over his head. He felt like he was failing all the time. The first five months were torturous. Here is the dream, but you want to be awesome in your dream. Instead, he felt like he was failing every day. But he did not give up. He kept trying. Little by little, got better. Somewhere around the time they did the first six months or so in America, then they took a little bit of time off for Christmas, then they went to Japan. He was sitting in Japan, where they were doing a month of shows at the Tokyo Dome with the biggest band in the world. Somewhere around there, he went, am I okay? I am okay, I think. By the time he left Japan, he was like, okay, I can have fun. This is okay. I am not terrible. I could be better. But holy cats, I am on tour with the Rolling Stones. By Europe, it was like a victory lap and so much fun and so many stories.

When you ask all of them why they made it, they're all like, oh, I I just didn't give up. And that's what they all want to talk about.

Scott Scovill

Scott has 17 guests in his book that chime in and write some things, really interesting people, and they all agree. These are people that are household names: Alan Jackson, Brad Paisley, Peter Frampton, Garth Brooks, a couple of astronauts, entrepreneurs. When you ask all of them why they made it, they are all like, oh, I just did not give up. That is what they all want to talk about. You think, these people are just so talented. That is why they are there. But even though some of them might have a photographic memory or pitch perfect hearing or the incredible ability to build muscle and balance, some of the athletes, none of them talk about that when you ask them how they made it. They are like, oh, I did not give up.

Why do they not talk about their talents? They say, well, sure, hopefully I have some talent. But then they will tell you people they knew that were more talented than they are. And you are like, who? And they are like, oh, you have never heard of them. They gave up. But this person had more talent than me. This is just something we should be talking more about.

An eidetic memory, a photographic memory would be incredible to have. But if you do not have one, you do not have one. You cannot develop that. Or pitch perfect hearing. You can get better at pitch, but not that thing. But tenacity, if that is the most important ingredient for them, that is one hundred percent developable because you can decide to be tenacious. And so long as you stick to it, you are. You can go from zero to one hundred percent of the thing that is the most important factor in their lives, and more simply his.

Tenacity, if that's the most important ingredient for them, that is 100% developable because you can decide to be tenacious. And so long as you stick to it, you are.

Scott Scovill

How Fear Actually Operates

Sometimes fear is a cliff, sometimes it is a wall, and sometimes you know you are afraid. Sometimes you are doing something that you do not really need to do, but you tell yourself you have to do it. You might be in your yard picking up sticks from the storm, you might be doing the laundry, you might be doing all sorts of things, because they need to be done instead of the scary thing. And you do not even realise that you are deflecting away from the scary thing. You do not even realise it a lot of the time. So yes, sometimes it is a cliff and a wall and a holy shit moment. And sometimes it is a, I am going to get around to that. But the mechanisms in your brain just sort of carefully protecting you, your ego is like, what if we do other things that will not hurt us instead?

Between those things, it is more often the little subtle things than the big obvious scary moment. But both of them freeze you in your tracks. When you are picking up sticks in your yard, you are not writing a book to try and release it in front of everybody. You are not chasing whatever your dream is.

The way that you get over that is one step at a time. You just say, all right, I am frozen. Take a step forward. And you go from being the person who was too afraid to do it, to you are still a mile away from your dream, but you are one step closer, and you are no longer the person that was too afraid to do it. You immediately, with the tiniest step, become the person who is doing it. That feels good. The former feels bad, just holding still and going, man, I really need to do that someday. Probably should do it today. You become the guy who is doing it. Yeah, I did this today. So I am moving towards my dream.

Just take one little step because that makes a huge difference in mindset. You go from the guy who is not doing it to the guy who is doing it. Might take ten years, took Scott seven years to get his book out, a better author would have had a book turned around in a year. But that is the whole point. You do not use tenacity to do the things that are easy for you. You use tenacity to do the things you would really like to do, even though they are hard. For him, writing a book was hard. It took seven years, seven times longer than a better author. But because he really wanted to do it, and it was worth it to him, he plugged away at it, he took one little step at a time after another after another. It feels awesome that he gets to share this story and hopefully help some people.

You go from being the person who was afraid too afraid to do it, to you're still a mile away from your dream. But you're one step closer, and you're no longer the person that was too afraid to do it. You immediately, with the tiniest step, become the person who's doing it.

Scott Scovill

From Baritone to Opening Act

Scott was told as a kid he could not sing. This is a great example of what you can do when you start employing tenacity and just embrace it. As a kid, he was told he could not sing. There were a lot of things he thought he could not do. He accepted that. And he believed that until he was in his forties. He got drunk at a party, about 4AM in Norway, on vacation. He started singing along to a Johnny Cash song on the radio. They turned down the radio, and this guy who was in a band said, you are singing with us tomorrow. And he said, no, I do not sing. And the guy said, yeah, you do. You are singing with us tomorrow. And he was just happy enough at that point that he went, okay.

The next day, he was so terrified by all this. But he got up on stage, and he sang the song Hurt, Johnny's rendition of that. He thought to a polite applause, hopped off stage, ran to the bar, and went, why did I do that? That was a terrible idea. No one needed to hear that. He said to the barmaid, I want all the beer, please, all of it. And he was ruminating, and he looked up and realised she was not moving. And she looked at him and said, I have goosebumps. It turns out he is a baritone. He grew up in the eighties where everyone is singing like Jonathan Cain from Journey. They are all up in this stratosphere and he sounds terrible up there. He is a baritone. If you put him down in a low register, he can sing. And he found out in his forties after a life in music that he could sing.

The band got off stage and said, join our band. And he said, no. What? You are a Norwegian band. I live in America. No. There is a fun backstory here. Tim Ferriss and Scott got to be friends. They hung out at a conference four years in a row. Scott asked him a question that he immediately regretted asking. He said, did you really do all that crazy stuff you said you did in the four hour work week? And Tim got quiet. And Scott went, I should not have asked him this question. Tim hesitated and said, I did. But here is the thing. The first few chapters were life happening to me. When I saw my company do great when I got out of the way, I said, this is an experiment I got to run. And he said, so all the other crazy stuff I did, I was running an experiment, and I knew I was writing a book about it.

Scott moved on to another subject, but he woke up the next morning and sat straight up in bed and went, son of a gun. My friend Tim had a life worth writing about because he was writing a book. Not the other way around. Now granted, Tim has had a really interesting life. But Scott made himself a promise. This is one of those moments where he made himself a promise. Only a few in his life. He said, I will never write a book. That turned out to be a lie. He did not know he was lying to himself at that point. He said, I will never write a book, but I am going to start living my life like I am writing a book. And I am going to constantly ask myself, what would make the next chapter more interesting? Because metaphorically, this is the book I am going to thumb through when I am sitting on my rocking chair, and maybe I do not have the energy I do now to climb mountains and do crazy stuff. So how can I make the book of my life the most interesting? And he made himself a promise he was going to start doing that.

The band asked him to join the band. And he sat there and thought about it for a little bit, and he was like, this would absolutely make the next chapter more interesting. So they asked him again about a drink later, he went, yes. Everybody cheered, and he went, okay. And he started flying to Norway to do a couple of guest songs with the band and loved it. It just evolved. To the point where they ended up being Brad Paisley's opening act. He hid it from everyone in town, and they announced them as playing on the main stage. They were doing pretty good at this huge festival, biggest festival in Norway. Two weeks later, they announced the headliner is Brad Paisley. And Scott was like, oh my gosh, I am the opening act for one of my best friends who has no idea that I sing.

It was pretty wild, telling Brad. The next day he was with him. And he said, so Norway? And Brad was like, yeah, you have got to come. Come with me. You always come with me. We will have so much fun. It will be great. And Scott was like, yeah, I am your opening act. And Brad was like, this is not funny. Scott said, it is not a joke. Brad said, but it is not funny. Scott said, it is not a joke. Finally, Brad said, okay. Sing something for me. Scott did not want to just belt out a lot. Brad had him sing a line of Hurt. Scott finished the line, and Brad said, you are my opening act.

What I Take From Scott

I have seen operators freeze at every level. The rep who knows the call needs to happen but finds three other things to do first. The founder who has the pitch deck ready but keeps tweaking it instead of booking the meeting. The leader who sees the hire they need to make but waits for more certainty. Scott's framing is blunt: the mind is the enemy. In his model you are not frozen because you do not know what to do. You are frozen because you are afraid it will go wrong.

What landed for me is how he describes the shift. You take one step, and you go from being the person too afraid to do it to the person doing it. That is not motivational padding. That is operationally true. The identity change happens the moment you move, not when you finish. You are still a mile from the outcome, but you are no longer the person who was too afraid to start. That feels different. That changes the next decision.

The other piece that sits with me is the deflection point. Fear does not always show up as a wall. More often it is the yard work, the inbox, the thing that feels productive but is actually protection. Scott calls it sublimating. Your ego carefully steers you away from the scary thing without you even realising it. I see that in every team I have built. The best operators learn to spot it in themselves and move anyway.

Tenacity is one hundred percent developable because you can decide to be tenacious and become it the moment you stick to it. That is the operator advantage. You cannot develop pitch perfect hearing. You cannot develop a photographic memory. But you can decide to keep moving, and the decision itself makes you the person who keeps moving. Scott took seven years to write his book. A better author would have done it in one. But he finished it, and now it is out in the world, and that only happened because he kept going when it was hard.

If you are waiting for certainty, for the right moment, for the fear to go away, you are waiting for something that does not come. The move is to take the step anyway. Open your mouth and let the song come out. You know what to do. The fear is a paper tiger. It looks real until you get close enough to see it cannot actually bite you. Move, and you become the person who moves. That is the whole game. You can hear the full conversation with Scott and more stories like this on the podcast.

Questions This Episode Answers

What was Scott Scovill diagnosed with that stopped him from trying?

Scott Scovill was diagnosed with an extreme fear of failure. A psychologist told him it would be easier to grab a red-hot stove and hang on than to actually try at anything. This fear caused him to flunk out of college and end up waiting tables at a highway Howard Johnson's before he decided to change his life.

How did Scott Scovill sneak into U2 shows for five weeks?

Scott made a fake laminate that was white on both sides, similar to the backside of the crew's official passes. He waited until after the show when stagehands were arriving and security was lighter. If caught, he would act like he had lost his official pass and run back to the bus, then sneak in through a different door. He lived in his Subaru BRAT pickup truck and drove all night between cities while the crew slept on the bus.

What do household names say is the reason they made it?

When Scott interviewed household names including Brad Paisley, Alan Jackson, Peter Frampton, Garth Brooks, astronauts, and entrepreneurs for his book, not one of them credited talent as the reason they made it. Every single one of them said they just did not give up. They all pointed to tenacity as the most important factor, and many told him about people more talented than them who gave up and you have never heard of.

How does fear actually stop people from moving forward?

Fear operates through small deflections more than big walls. You do not always realise you are afraid. Instead, you find yourself picking up sticks in the yard, doing laundry, or handling other tasks that feel productive but are actually your ego protecting you from the scary thing. You tell yourself these things need to be done instead of facing the thing you are actually avoiding. This subtle deflection freezes you just as effectively as an obvious wall.

Why is tenacity the most important success factor?

Tenacity is one hundred percent developable. You cannot develop a photographic memory or pitch perfect hearing, but you can decide to be tenacious and become it the moment you stick to it. One step forward instantly changes who you are from the person too afraid to do it to the person doing it. You might still be a mile from your dream, but you are no longer the person who was too afraid to start.

How did Scott Scovill discover he could sing after being told he could not?

Scott was told as a kid he could not sing and believed it until his forties. At a party in Norway at 4AM, he sang along to a Johnny Cash song and a band member insisted he sing with them the next day. When he performed Hurt, a barmaid told him she had goosebumps. It turned out he is a baritone. He grew up in the eighties when everyone sang in a high register like Journey, where he sounds terrible, but in a low register he can sing.

Full Transcript7,713 words

Kayvon Kay0:00A psychologist once told today's guest that it would be easier for him to grab a red hot stove and hold on than to actually try at anything. That was the diagnosis, an extreme fear of failure. He flunked out of college. He waited tables at a highway Howard Johnson's. Then a u two tour bus rolled into the parking lot and changed everything. Scott Scoville quit his jobs, sold his car, and spent five weeks living in a pickup truck sneaking into U two shows with a fake pass working for free. Three years later, he was on tour with the Rolling Stones, the biggest tour in the world. Today, he runs video for the biggest names in country music he just opened for Brad Paisley in Norway, and he wrote a book called Tenacious with contributions from Garth Brooks, Peter Frampton, and Alan Jackson. This episode is about the one trait every one of those names credits for their success. It is not talent. This is the vault unlocked. Let's unlock it.

Kayvon Kay1:14This is a story about tenacity. How about a young man who traveled and chased U2 across the country ended up on stages and opening up for Brad Praisely? I'm excited to hear this story because I think everybody needs to hear it. Today, we're going behind the vault about how you can make your dreams come true. Scott, welcome,

Scott Scovill1:43welcome, welcome. Welcome to the show. It is so good to be here.

Kayvon Kay1:47It's so I can't wait. Where do we begin?

Scott Scovill1:51Well, I guess we could begin at rock bottom. That's a great place to start any story. Right? As a kid, I was, I barely graduated high school. My teachers literally got together with me and said, we think we're gonna push you out. I went on to college. I flunked out of college. And at that same time, I was diagnosed with such an extreme fear of failure. My psychologist said it would be easier for you to grab a red hot stove and hang on and maim yourself than to actually try. Powerful, crazy diagnosis, but it felt right. Every time I tried to do my homework, I'd end up in tears. I just couldn't apply myself. And that put me in a pretty dark place because my fear of failure had me flunking out of college, had me actually failing. It was manifesting my worst fear. And I end up waiting tables at Howard Johnson's on the side of the highway, not my dream job, and I wasn't even a very good waiter. But this amazing tour bus rolls in with a space shuttle painted on the side of it, and I'm like, I wanna wait on them. I honestly thought they worked for NASA. Like, why the space shuttle? I didn't know what a tour bus was. I was really disappointed when they walked off the bus, and they all were wearing black and had long hair. I'm like, they don't look like they work for NASA. But I took their drink orders and said, why the bus? And one of them in the thickest of Irish accents goes, we work for the band U2 we put on the show. That blew my mind. And I had a million questions. And I'm like, I don't understand. How can you work for the band U2? What what do you mean? I would have thought you had to be Bono's cousin to do that. And the guy in charge laughs, and he goes, Scott, seven of us are the very best in the world at what we do. We put on the show, the lights, the sound, and he puts his arm around the guy next to him and goes, and this is AJ. He's Bono's cousin. And so everyone starts laughing, and they revealed to me a world that was incredible. And finally, after a million questions, they said, we have to go. Why don't you just come to the next show and we'll answer more of your questions? Yes. So I go to that show. I have a million more questions. I'm so fascinated about it. They introduced me to Bono and Edge, and I was more interested in their career that I had discovered than the fact that I just met two of my heroes. I was like, what? Lights went out, crowd went nuts. I'm standing in the middle of 15,000 screaming fans, and I had a paradigm shift. This is what you're going to do with your life. You love music, you love technology, you love travel, oh my gosh, you're going to see the world with you too. A moment later, my heart sank when I realized to do any of this, I was going to have to try. I made myself a promise standing there in the dark that I was going to start trying and never stop trying no matter how bad it got or how much it hurt. In that moment, tenacity was born within me. Now it was a struggle for the next few years, but that's that's where it started.

Kayvon Kay4:56Wow. You hear every story has that rock bottom in a moment where the lights go down. It's just you and the world, and you have to face the question, do I actually want to change my life? Do I want more? And it sounds like and seems like that was one of those moments for you.

Scott Scovill5:18Yeah. They're few and far between. Right? A pivotal moment like that. I've had maybe two or three in my life. This was a massive one for me. And it led to the dumbest plan ever. I decided that I was going to quit my three jobs, sell my Super Sport Camaro. School was flunking me out, so no big deal leaving there. And I moved into my Subaru BRAT, those tiny little pickup trucks, and I started sneaking into u two shows and working for free. My plan was I was going to make myself invaluable to them. And somehow they didn't have me arrested. The police almost arrested me three times getting in the building, but the the the crew was like, what are you doing in here? And I'm like, I'm just figuring it out. Don't worry. I'm just another one of the stagehands. And for five weeks, I snuck in every day, worked for free. And while they were all sleeping on the bus, I was driving all night to the next city. I just killed myself doing it. But it was a start. I was finally moving.

Kayvon Kay6:18And then I mean, most people to me, even there, I have to tell you, it's like it just seems unbelievable. So you how are you even getting in? Like, so you show up and you're like, I am I'm just the hands here, obviously. Like and then and then who do you know who to speak to to get you to do a job? And how how like, the safe work policies, all that stuff. Like, how how does how does that even happen? It's There's a lot to all that. So maybe

Scott Scovill6:42check out the book. But Yeah. I will say, to answer your first one, I had a fake laminate, but it wasn't totally a fake laminate. I just the backside of their laminates that was white. Who does that? Nowadays, they're never white. I made a laminate that was white on both sides, And then I saw that they had, like, radio channels. They also had laminates passes hanging around their necks that had, like, radio channel numbers and things on them they needed to remember. And so I made that, but not the official pass. And then I would just pile it now. When you're trying to get in during the show, security is high. If you wait till after the show when the stagehands are showing up, way lighter. So I did that. I wasn't going to the shows. I wasn't a groupie. I was a roadie groupie. I wanted to be in with the work. And so it was lighter, and I would just look like I didn't wanna be there with my fake laminate hanging around my neck. And if someone caught me and stopped me, which happened pretty often, I would act freaked out that I had lost my laminate and not seem like I was worried about getting in trouble with them. I'd be like, oh my god. They're gonna kill me. God. Maybe it's on the bus. And I would turn around and, like, run back up the ramp like I was going to the bus to find my laminate. Yeah. And then I would sneak in a different door. And Wow. Only only three times did it get to where I was talking to the police and having to do some fast talking. But Yeah. Yeah. They didn't arrest me.

Kayvon Kay8:06No. There was a man on a mission there. So so fast forward here because I I mean, that can spend the whole time on that story alone. So what happens? Now you're you said you've been following them for a couple weeks, couple months.

Scott Scovill8:20Yeah. Yeah. And they I'd become something of a mas mascot. They were rooting for me. The truck drivers and all that were pulling for me. And every now and then, they'd lay on the horn if I was swerving a little bit, and they'd yell at me at the truck stops. You gotta pull over. You can't make it all night. And I'd be like, okay. And then I would just pull out way behind them so they couldn't see me anymore because if I lost them, I'd have to find the place, and GPSs didn't exist back then. This is 1987 I'm doing this. So I'm using a Rand McNally Road Atlas to find the venue. No. Thanks. I'd rather follow the bus. But, I did all that for five weeks. Felt like I was maybe making some impact, but the reality is they were all experts at what they did. I was just figuring out how to coil cables and latch road cases. Right? Like, I was I didn't belong. But, five weeks in, the union in Buffalo, had a dispute with a band, and someone was saying something about me, and that ended up in the union's ears. And so in their argument over a bigger problem, they said, and you have nonunion labor here working with you, and that's stealing union jobs, and they fined the band $5,000. Now I don't think the band ever had to pay it, but that event drew attention to me. And upper management went, what are you guys doing? You're letting this kid roll around? Like, he's gonna fall asleep in the middle of the night, crash his car, and his parents are gonna sue us, and, his life is gonna be on our hands. He has to go. So I made it five weeks before that moment. That's still I mean I mean, it's still impressive.

Kayvon Kay9:52That's very impressive. Living in try living in your car for five days. Yeah. I lived in it for five weeks. I couldn't imagine. I can't imagine. So then what happens? You find you get caught. Obviously,

Scott Scovill10:05tenacity is in you. So where does it go? Good timing. Right? Because, video was brand new to the industry. And so I was I had a lot of time to think while I was driving from city to city. And I'm like, if I'm gonna get into this industry, I wanna do the thing that's brand new. Instead of getting on the bottom rung of the lighting ladder, I didn't wanna be, like, brand new at the thing that people have been doing for thirty years. Why don't I be brand new at the thing that's been around for a year? Video was literally brand new at shows at that point. And so that's what I did. I I, got some great advice from the crew who were great friends to me. And they said, you know, hey, go to school for this. Lawrence Anderson from the crew said, go to school for this projector because nobody knows how to run it and you'll get work. And I did. I was hired before I even got out of the one week long class on how to do the projector. A company out of DC hired me. I did corporate video for a year and a half. The company was great. My coworkers were great. I hated the work. No loud screaming fans. No music. Just ballrooms and videos on why software is good. You should buy it and things like that. But I've I learned the gear and kept trying to put myself in the right place at the right time and managed to, be in the right place at the right time and draw interest from someone who had just gotten the Rolling Stones tour. So within three years of that U2 encounter, I was on tour with the Rolling Stones doing the biggest tour in the world. Wow. Wow. But the important thing is that whole thing where I would fall into tears trying and couldn't try, In those three years, I got over that. And I learned that failure is not death. It is not the end of the world. It is in fact, it's a stepping stone. It's necessary. It's where you learn everything. You learn everything in failure, you learn nothing from not failing and hanging it out there. And when I, with that knowledge and that tenacity that I had to build up to overcome my dysfunction, I've just applied that time and time again throughout my life to chase dream after dream. So, yeah, it got me my first dream. But more importantly, it it has been the key element in this life I live.

Kayvon Kay12:24Yeah. I mean, I I I couldn't couldn't agree more when you talk about, you know, we learn more in failure than we ever do in our in our successes. That that's the truth. Yeah. So I again, I just I can't like, five weeks of following YouTube, and now you're actually on tour traveling with the Rolling Stones.

Scott Scovill12:46Still hard because I felt like I was in over my head. I felt like I was failing all the time. I still wasn't first five months of it were, well, I would say torturous. Like, here's the dream, but you want to be awesome in your dream. And instead, I felt like I was failing every day. And I I just but I didn't give up. And I kept trying. And little by little, got better. And somewhere around, we did, we did the first six months or so we're in America, then we took like a little bit of time off for Christmas, then we went to Japan. And I'm sitting in Japan, where we're doing a month of shows at the Tokyo Dome with the biggest band in the world. And somewhere around there, I went like, am I am I okay? I'm okay, I think. And that by the end by the time I left Japan, I'm like, I'm like, okay, I can have fun. This is okay. I'm not terrible. I could be better. But holy cats, I'm on tour with the Rolling Stones. And by Europe, it was like a victory lap and and so much fun and so many stories.

Kayvon Kay13:51That's there there's a story within a story there. It almost sounds like when you were in Rolling Stones, it was just the biggest tour on stage at that time guaranteed.

Scott Scovill14:02It was the biggest in the world, for for decades. It was 450 crew members. It was massive. And I was one of the 38 that had to be in every city.

Kayvon Kay14:12Because it sounds like in that moment, your identity hadn't caught up with who you were actually being in the world.

Scott Scovill14:19Imposter syndrome. I mean, I really wasn't as good as I wanted to be, but are we ever? But to me, at that point, it was still that was still like death. You had to be perfect. So we all have our reasons why we have dysfunctions like this. And I could write a whole book on why I have those dysfunctions. But instead, I chose to write a book on how I got over them because I think it's the same way you get over any dysfunction, what whatever it is. And that's by just don't let the fear of what it is keep you from trying, keep you from getting out there and failing because, man, not trying is failing, and failing is nowhere near as bad in reality as it was in my head. And that is so true, I think. That's I I

Kayvon Kay15:06wow. Failing was nowhere near as bad in reality than it was in my head.

Scott Scovill15:13Yeah. And I think that's always the truth. There's a great quote in the book. Amelia Earhart says, your fears are paper tigers. And I'm like, yeah. Like, they look really scary. And you get close-up on them, you're like, this isn't even a real tiger. Like, this can't even bite me. And and maybe the failure hurts, and it it does. Right? But it's not the end of the world. To me as a kid, it was so terrifying that it just froze me in my tracks. But getting over that has helped with everything. And, and, you know, I have 17 guests in my book that chime in and write some things, some really interesting people, and they all agree. And these are people that are household names, you know, Alan Jackson, Brad Paisley, Peter Frampton, know, Garth Brooks, Alan let's see, a couple of astronauts, entrepreneurs. When you ask all of them why they made it, they're all like, oh, I I just didn't give up. And that's what they all want to talk about. And we all kind of maybe we all do, but I think I did. You think, these people are just so talented. That's why they're there. But even though some of them might have a photographic memory or pitch perfect hearing or the incredible ability to build muscle and balance some of the athletes, none of them talk about that when you ask them how they made it. They're like, oh, I didn't give up. And so, you know, I'm like, Well, why don't you talk about your talents? And they're like, Well, sure. Hopefully, I have some talent. But then they'll tell you people they knew that were more talented than they are. And you're like, Who? And you're like, Oh, you've never heard of them. They gave up. But this person had more talent than me. And you're like, wow, this is just something we should be talking more about.

Kayvon Kay17:00I couldn't agree more. I don't know if, anyone who's listening heard the, the natural plug in there. But in his book, Garth Brooks, Brad Paisley, astronauts. I mean, this is no joke of a book here. Obviously you've got a network. And I love what you just said in all of those people, all different walks of life who've done some, I'm gonna say some great things, probably gotten to the top 1% of their careers. They don't look at it and go, it's because I had the talent or some special skill. They look at it and they say, I'm only here because I never gave up.

Scott Scovill17:41Yep, all of them feel that way. And, you know, an eidetic memory, a photographic memory would be incredible to have. But if you don't have one, you don't have one. You can't develop that. Or pitch perfect hearing, right? You can get better at pitch, but not that thing. But tenacity, if that's the most important ingredient for them, that is 100% developable because you can decide to be tenacious. And so long as you stick to it, you are. So you can go from zero to 100% of the thing that's the most important factor in their lives, and more simply mine. And I just felt like that was something that had to be

Kayvon Kay18:22discussed, and we had to shine a light on it. So let me ask you this because I think it I'm I'm interested. You're writing this book on tenacity, and you're hearing these perspectives of all these great people, when was it or what clicked when writing this book when you said, oh, now I really understand what being tenacious looks like or what tenacity means. So I'm gonna ask you that question right now from all of this. What does tenacity mean to you? I

Scott Scovill18:55think that, there's just layers of it. But I I think that when I first started writing, I was like, what would I write about? Because a friend suggested he's like, you're such a storyteller. Please write a book. And I was like, I don't think so. And then without asking me, the next day, his publisher called me and said, I hear we're doing some books. And I'm like, no. But if I did, what would I do? And I started thinking about it. And the moment I thought tenacity, I was like, well, that's the story I have to tell. Because the first thing you say is why would anyone read my book? Like, I'm not that cool. There are people that I admire that are way cooler than me, like read their books. But then when I started thinking about it, I was like, well, that's the story that I would tell. But surely it's been told. And I googled it and looked and there are books that are entitled tenacity or tenacious, but they're always one story that they just felt like it was a tenacious story. It's not about tenacity. The closest was a book called Grit by Angela Duckworth. Fantastic book. But she wrote it from a scientific point of view. She is a professor and has a psychology degree, and she wrote more of an analytical book. And I think it's absolutely wonderful. But I wanted to come on the other side of that with very personal stories told by the people who live them. And because I don't like to be told what to do. I am awful at that. And so so many books that maybe are geared to help you, I struggle with because they tell me what to do. And unfortunately, to my own peril, I will very often not do that. But if you tell me a story that you lived through and I can celebrate the victories with you and die a little bit with you when it goes south, I will learn from that, and I'll enjoy the ride. And so that's the kind of book I wanted to write. And that's how I wanted to present my thoughts on it. So I never tell you what to do. And I asked my guests to never do that either. What we will occasionally do is ask you a question. Like, you know, do you do you wonder what it would be like if you had made different decisions ten years ago? Because that's what my character is doing at this moment in the book. I get that. Let me ask you this. How would you feel ten years from now if you realized that this was the moment when you made a different decision and started acting differently? And so I ask people questions like that. But I never say, hey, do this. Because if you tell me what to do, I probably won't.

Kayvon Kay21:33Probably like most people. So how does how do you go from I I can see maybe a little train here, but I feel like something there was a little bit of a gap. But how do you go from chasing YouTube to impostor syndrome, you know, with the Rolling Stones of Japan to I love what you said, I really love the comment you said, to a celebration tour of oneself. I'm gonna call it the celebration tour of the identity meeting the person you actually are in the world through Europe to writing, I guess, the book with all these professionals to opening up now. Because you were tech guy rolling coil, you said coil or whatever you said, you know, carrying the equipment to learning some tech to actually opening up or you're working for the people that are opening up for breath. No. I'm opening. I'm not singing. You're not singing.

Scott Scovill22:32Am. I'm singing. You're you're you're singing. I'm opening an opening act now. Yeah. I've I headline some festivals now over in Europe. I was told as a kid I couldn't sing. And this is a great example of what you can do when you start employing tenacity and just embrace it. As a kid, I was told I couldn't sing. There were a lot of things I thought I couldn't do. I accepted that. And I believe that until I was in my forties. And I got drunk at a party, and it's about 4AM in Norway. I'm on vacation. And I start singing along to a Johnny Cash song on the radio. And they turned on the radio, and this guy who's in a band goes, you're singing with us tomorrow. And I go, no, I don't sing. And he goes, yeah, you do. You're singing with us tomorrow. And I was just happy enough at that point that I went, okay. Well, the next day, I was so terrified by all this. I'm like, what is happening? Like, what? Oh my god. Like, no. But I got up on stage, and I sang the song Hurt, Johnny's rendition of that. I thought to a polite applause, I hopped off stage, ran to the bar, and went like, why did I do that? That was a terrible idea. No one needed to hear that. And I said to the barmaid, I want all the beer, please, all of it. And I'm ruminating, and I look up and realize she's not moving. And I'm like, yeah. And she looks at me and says, I have goosebumps. I'm like, what? It turns out I am a baritone. And I grew up in the eighties where everyone is singing like one of my guests, Jonathan Kane from Journey. Don't stop believing. They're all up in this stratosphere and I sound terrible up there. I'm a baritone. If you put me down in a low register, I can sing. And I found out in my forties after a life in music that I could sing.

Kayvon Kay24:26Band gets off stage. You just did it up there. I I was I I was like, I love it because you didn't your people haven't talked to my people, and there's no no one said I cannot do x or y. So I have to just I'm I'm dying to hear, like, just one or two lines of you singing Hurt because I love that song. Like, I love Johnny Cash. If you may just forgive me. Woah. Anyway No. No. No. No. Not anyway, man. Like,

Scott Scovill25:02goosebumps. Yeah. Check out my version on, Spotify. I start yelling at the end. Okay. I will. It's fun. I mean, you don't wanna do it exactly like the artist did it. Right? So by the time at the end, he's going if you know, Johnny's like, if I could start again. Not my version. I'm like, if I could start again.

Kayvon Kay25:23And I'm just screaming. It's fun. It's fun. I'll definitely you know, we'll put that in the show notes too. Okay. This is awesome.

Scott Scovill25:34Wow. It's fun. Wow. It's fun. Life should be fun. Mhmm. So, yeah, I I I the band gets off stage and they're like, join our band. And I'm like, no. What? You're a Norwegian band. I live in America. No. So there's a fun backstory here. Tim Ferriss and I got to be friends. We hung out at a conference four years in a row. And I asked him a question that I immediately regretted asking. I said, did you really do all that crazy stuff you said you did in the four hour work week? And he got quiet. And I went, I shouldn't have asked him this question. By the way, also probably one in the morning, two in the morning, I probably also had a few too many drinks. I don't drink anymore, but I used to be quite well trained at it. But he hesitated and he goes, I did. But here's the first few chapters were life happening to me. When I saw my company do great when I got out of the way, I said, this is an experiment I got to run. And he said, so all the other crazy stuff I did, I was running an experiment, and I knew I was writing a book about it. And I was like, oh, that's a great answer. And and so I moved on other subject, but I woke up the next morning and sat straight up in bed and went, son of a gun. My friend Tim had a life worth writing about because he was writing a book. Not the other way around. Now granted, Tim's had a really interesting life. But I made myself a promise. This is one of those moments where I made myself a promise. Only a few in my life. I said, you know what? I'm I'll never write a book. That turned out to be a lie. I didn't know I was lying to myself at that point. I said, I'll never write a book, but I'm gonna start living my life like I'm writing a book. And I'm gonna constantly ask myself, what would make the next chapter more interesting? Because metaphorically, this is the book I'm gonna thumb through when I'm sitting on my rocking chair, and maybe I don't have the energy I do now to, like, climb mountains and do crazy stuff. So how can I make the book of my life the most interesting? And I made myself a promise I was going to start doing that. And Tim so the band asked me to join the band. And I sat there and thought about it for a little bit, and I'm like, this would absolutely make the next chapter more interesting. So they asked me again about a drink later, I went, yes. Everybody cheered, and I went, okay. And I started flying to Norway to do a couple of guest songs with the band and loved it. And then I was like, it just evolved. And to the point where we ended up being Brad Paisley's opening act. I hid it from everyone in town, and they announce us as playing on the main stage. We're doing pretty good. We're at this huge festival, biggest festival in Norway, in Sjord. And two weeks later, they announced the headliner is Brad Paisley. And I'm like, oh my gosh, I am the opening act for one of my best friends who has no idea that I sing. And it was pretty wild, telling him I would the next day I was with him. And I said, so Norway? And he's like, yeah, you gotta come. Come with me. You always come with me. We'll have so much fun. It'll be great. And I'm like,

Kayvon Kay28:51yeah, I'm your opening act. Oh, he's like, god. Come on, people. I hope you're listening these stories here. This is wild. Like, what? No.

Scott Scovill28:59And he he's like, this is not funny. I go, it's not a joke. He goes, but it's not funny. I go, I you know it's not funny. It's not a joke. And finally, he finally, he goes, okay. Sing something for me. I'm like, I don't wanna just belt out a lot. So I he had me sing a line of hurt. And I finished the line, and he goes, you're my opening act. I'm like, yeah. I go and I need you to do me a favor, be kind. I'm just having fun. Like, don't hold me to your standard of perfection, which is part of why he's so great. Like everything has to be perfect. And that's part of what makes Brad Paisley Brad Paisley. But here I am singing in front of an entertainer of the year going, but he has been kind. And, yeah, I mean, I'm his opening act yet again this year in Europe. So if you are in Norway on June eleventh or thirteenth, I'll be singing in front of 10,000 people, singing originals I wrote and having a great time. And would I have done any of this were it not for being tenacious all those years ago and learning that tool? Absolutely not. I mean, was afraid of public speaking. But as soon as I realized I'm afraid of anything now, I charge straight towards it. I don't. I remember having that when fear had power over me, and I hated it. And I was ashamed of it. Now when I realized something scares me, I run towards it. And thankfully, I conquered my fear of public speaking. Because that's the only way I could have gotten up on stage that night. And how great is my life? Because I was brave enough to do to go overcome the public speaking part.

Kayvon Kay30:33You say some things and you kind of roll past them like they're not big, but they land to me in ways that I think should be discovered and really pronounced. I now run towards the fear. Yeah, that that's not light like that's not a it's not something we just take easy here like so many people. I don't like generalizing. So I'm gonna say there's a lot of people that I even know my own personal network and myself included sometimes, sometimes where the fear is paralyzing. You want to get past it. Want to. You hear about running to it. You hear about these people. They run to it and you do it. But right when you get to the tip of it, you get paralyzed. Or in some cases there's some people don't even nope. They run. If anything, they run far away from it. They live on the opposite side of it. With your stories and the people that have gone through your path. And I mean, this book that I cannot wait to get my hands on. When we're talking about that and we go deep to a deeper level about that, what happens for you or what you've seen in this book when people are faced with this fear and the wall of fear is there or the cliff of fear is there,

Scott Scovill31:53and they run to it. I'll back it up to say, sometimes it's a cliff, sometimes it's a wall, and sometimes you know you're afraid. Sometimes you're doing something that you don't really need to do, but you tell yourself you have to do it. And, you know, you might be in your yard picking up sticks from the storm, you might be doing the laundry, you might be doing all sorts of things, because they need to be done instead of the scary thing. And you don't even realize that you're sublimating, if that's the right word, you're deflecting away from the scary thing. You don't even realize it a lot of the time. So yes, sometimes it's a cliff, and a wall and a holy shit moment. And sometimes it's a, I'm gonna get around to that. But it's for the mechanisms in your brain just sort of carefully protecting you, your egos, like, what if we do other things that won't hurt us instead? And I think that between those things, yeah, it's more often the little subtle things than the big obvious scary moment. But both of them freeze you in your tracks. When you're picking up sticks in your yard, you're not writing a book to try and release it in front of everybody. You're not chasing whatever your dream is. So yeah, I think the way that you get over that is one step at a time. You just say like, all right, I'm frozen. I liked your analogy. You said you're just you know, you're frozen. I think that's I don't remember exactly how you put it, but you're not moving forward. It freezes you. I guess you're paralyzed. Yeah, you're paralyzed. That's the word you use. You're paralyzed. Well, take a step forward. And you go from being the person who was afraid too afraid to do it, to you're still a mile away from your dream. But you're one step closer, and you're no longer the person that was too afraid to do it. You immediately, with the tiniest step, become the person who's doing it. And that feels good to me. The the former feels bad, just holding still and going, man, I really need to do that someday. Probably should do it today. To you become the guy who's doing it. Yeah, I did this today. So I'm moving towards my dream. And so I encourage people, just take one little step because that makes a huge difference to me in my mindset. I go from the guy who's not doing it to the guy who's doing it. Might take me ten years, took me seven years to get this book out, a better author would have had a book turned around in a year. But that's the whole point. You don't use tenacity to do the things that are easy for you. You use tenacity to do the things you'd really like to do, even though they're hard. So for me, writing a book was hard. It took me seven years, seven times longer than a better author. But because I really wanted to do it, and it was worth it to me, I plugged away at it, I took one little step at a time after another after another. And I'm gonna tell you, it feels awesome that I get to share this story and hopefully help some help some people. I am. I'm proud. I'm proud of what I did. And I did it one little step at a time.

Kayvon Kay35:13You should be proud of what you did. Absolutely, you should be. I think it's it's fascinating, your story, and I love I love it. I'm asking, I'm sitting here going, what what's he doing with his time? Where where do you spend your time? You got the like, the book is written. You get to go to Norway, you know, Brad Pate crazily. To me, it's like, wow, okay. And where else do you spend your time? What are you doing? Where are you? You know So yesterday, I was in the studio recording three new songs. Okay.

Scott Scovill35:45It makes sense to release music when you're doing big shows. So I'm gonna have something out, either my hangover song or my song about murder. Okay. I don't really kill anybody. In the book, you'll see that I do psychedelic therapy. I have a whole section on being the best version of yourself. And so I wrote a book, I wrote a song called I'm gonna put you in the ground. And man, there's an antagonist that's just awful to my character, to the point where my character is ready to kill him. I mean, he he makes him feel stupid. He he steals his sweetheart. He tells him love is not for him. He crushes his dreams. And my character has to he's just the point where he's ready to kill him. And he does. And that's the song. But but your listeners will know that the gun is actually the psychedelics and and the terrifying moment that I decided to go ahead and try and help see myself better. And who what I'm killing is fear and doubt that doesn't belong to me, that was hardwired into me through some things that happened in my childhood. And yeah, so the last line of the song is really fun. It says as the smoke clears, I find that I have all of me standing over what's left of who I used to be. I'd love to shoot a music video for it. It'd be fun to do like a western, right? You never see the bad guy until the final frame. You realize that the bad guy and the good guy are the same person. So yeah, I did that. I love creating. I love making music. Tomorrow, I fly to New York to take care of my mom. She has dementia. She is my hero. She's one of the contributors to the book. And I love being with her and taking care of her and spending what time I can. Next week, it's more stuff promoting the book and more music stuff. And then the and then on the next weekend, I'll be at Luke Combs show in Knoxville because he's one of my he's one of my about Luke Combs. Sorry. Forgot about Luke Collins. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he's not in the book. But Sorry, Luke. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. No. Maybe the next one. I love Luke. He's a fantastic client. We just aren't he and I aren't personally as close as the ones that I put in the book. But he's a great human, great human. So yeah, life is really interesting. I probably do a little too much, but I kinda like it that way.

Kayvon Kay38:05So I know people are dying. Where where can we get this book?

Scott Scovill38:09Well, everywhere. Honestly, search my name, Scott Scovel, and it's available pretty much everywhere with Simon and Schuster doing distribution. But, go to tenaciousbook.com. There's a good place to get steered in any direction. It's obviously on Amazon. There's also scottscovel.com. There's no Eon Scovel. I'm not like the unit for hotness. Although Brad Paisley has a funny quote about that. But, yeah. So yeah, the the scottthescottscovel.com, tenaciousbook.com. But of course, it's on Amazon and Barnes and Noble and my Norwegian friends, it's at ARC bookstores, and it's pretty much everywhere.

Kayvon Kay38:46You're a story guy. So I'm going to try to visualize this last question because it's coming to me. It's I don't even know why, but I think it's powerful. I want you I want you to imagine you're walking on the stage, the lights are out, it's dark, and you get to the right to the end of that long stage, the guitars around your, you know, around your waist there. And in order for the lights to turn on, you have to strum that first beat. And you're sitting there and you're paralyzed. And you're in your head going, I'm not worthy. There's no way I should be here. But the show must start. What advice would you give that person or yourself in that moment to just pick up the pick and let it rip.

Scott Scovill39:38You know what to do, like not, you're not frozen because you don't know what to do. You're frozen because you're afraid it will go wrong. Just just pick up that pick and strum, man, just hit it. You know what to do. And the moment you start so I'll give you a better, a more specific example. In my show, I like to open acapella with a slowed down version of Folsom. So the in pitch black, people hear me singing. I hear that train coming. It's rolling around the bend, and I walk out and the spotlight hits me, and it's just me with no band. And I do the first chorus of Folsom by myself. And I am terrified listening to the of the crowd backstage. Yeah. And then that first note comes out. And I'm realize, I know how to sing. And then a moment later, I realize I'm hitting the note. And then a moment after that, I realize, this is amazing. And from there on in, it's easy. So there's your first step. Just open your mouth and let the let the song come out.

Kayvon Kay40:55Scott, I just gotta tell you, it I I we can almost do another episode because I know we just starting to scratch the surface here. I wanted I wanna thank you. Thank you for taking the time out of your busy day traveling and obviously promoting the book and stopping in and having a conversation with us. I'll be putting all this in the show notes, everybody, you where you can get the songs, where you get the book, all of that. And, we we we here at the Vault Unlocked just wanna say thank you. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you. Super fun. I love your work and really great to spend some time with you and your listeners.

Scott Scovill41:30Thank you.

This write-up was produced from the recording of Why Talented People Fail and Tenacious People Don't (The U2 Roadie Who Proved It). Every quote is verbatim and timestamped to the audio above.

Show Notes

A psychologist told Scott Scovill it would be easier for him to grab a red-hot stove and hang on than to try at anything. His fear of failure was that severe. It flunked him out of college and left him waiting tables at a roadside Howard Johnson's.

Then a tour bus rolled in one day, and everything he believed about talent, fear, and what it takes to make it got dismantled.

In this conversation, Kayvon pulls apart how a college dropout with a clinical fear of failure snuck into U2 shows for five weeks with a homemade laminate, lived in his car, worked for free, and landed on the biggest Rolling Stones tour in the world within three years. Scott breaks down the pattern he found when interviewing household names for his book, including Brad Paisley, Alan Jackson, Peter Frampton, and Olympic champion Scott Hamilton. He also spoke to NASA astronauts, athletes, CEOs, a Navy SEAL, and many more. None of them credit talent. Every one of them credits refusing to quit. He explains why the most talented people you've never heard of gave up, why fear operates through small deflections more than big walls, and why one step forward instantly changes who you are.

This episode is for founders, operators, and sales professionals who have been hiding behind preparation, credentials, or perfectionism instead of moving. If you believe talent is the reason others are winning, this conversation will take that excuse away from you.

The episode covers overcoming fear of failure, building a business from nothing, the mindset behind long-term success, how top performers in music and entertainment think about risk, and why tenacity is the only success factor that is one hundred percent developable. Scott's story maps directly onto sales, leadership, and entrepreneurship, where the gap between knowing what to do and doing it decides everything.

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